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PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:18 am 
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Space Floater
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marhawkman wrote:
I found myself using Galleons for almost everything mid-game because of the limits on everything else. (and galleons have awesome fuel efficiency when not loaded.)

Well, I have never used Galleons much, even in the mid-game. It depends a lot on your style of game play, and also the size of your game map. I always play on huge maps, and always end up building large swarms of cruisers in the mid-game. Galleons seem to be too expensive for creating killer fleets with huge overwhelming amounts of firepower. They are a very good general purpose hull, of course, and are good at a lot of things, but for specialized roles, more specialized hulls are usually better.


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 2:17 am 
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Alberjohns wrote:
marhawkman wrote:
I found myself using Galleons for almost everything mid-game because of the limits on everything else. (and galleons have awesome fuel efficiency when not loaded.)

Well, I have never used Galleons much, even in the mid-game. It depends a lot on your style of game play, and also the size of your game map. I always play on huge maps, and always end up building large swarms of cruisers in the mid-game. Galleons seem to be too expensive for creating killer fleets with huge overwhelming amounts of firepower. They are a very good general purpose hull, of course, and are good at a lot of things, but for specialized roles, more specialized hulls are usually better.
Beleive it or not, Galleons beat Cruisers hands down. why? Their actual offense ability is about the same, but Galleons can mount 2-3 times as much defensive equipment. They also have a pretty good speed if they aren't loaded. The catch is that they are more expensive.

But that's a bit off topic. On topic? Galleons are the only decently flexible hull mid game. early game there just aren't any. stars just doesn't have them.

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 11:57 pm 
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marhawkman wrote:
Alberjohns wrote:
Well, I have never used Galleons much, even in the mid-game. It depends a lot on your style of game play, and also the size of your game map. I always play on huge maps, and always end up building large swarms of cruisers in the mid-game. Galleons seem to be too expensive for creating killer fleets with huge overwhelming amounts of firepower. They are a very good general purpose hull, of course, and are good at a lot of things, but for specialized roles, more specialized hulls are usually better.

Beleive it or not, Galleons beat Cruisers hands down. why? Their actual offense ability is about the same, but Galleons can mount 2-3 times as much defensive equipment. They also have a pretty good speed if they aren't loaded. The catch is that they are more expensive.

Well, that is the point. They are more expensive. The greater flexibility must be paid for. Everything comes with a cost. Now, it is true that you can put greater numbers of defensive equipment on Galleons, but all of this equipment costs a lot too, thus increasing the cost of the entire ship, and also increasing the WEIGHT of the ship, which may prevent it from being able to go though warp gates because warp gates have a weight limit unless you play an Interstellar Traveler race.

So you see, when you consider the costs involved, cruisers are often preferable to highly expensive Galleons maxed out with defensive equipment.
marhawkman wrote:
But that's a bit off topic. On topic? Galleons are the only decently flexible hull mid game. early game there just aren't any. stars just doesn't have them.

That is a GOOD thing, in my opinion. Star! does provide some very flexible hulls for people like you who like to put everything including the kitchen sink on their ships. But on the other hand, it also provides more specialized ship hulls which may be less flexible, but also provide very real advantages which the more flexible hulls do not have. I think FreeOrion should copy this.


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2007 11:41 pm 
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FreeOrion Lead Emeritus
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Thanks for the input in this thread guys, I'll be reviewing it shortly. Just got a few things to do soon, but then I'll be on to it. After that we'll start the next discussion to keep things moving.

Thanks


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PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2007 2:02 pm 
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Based on the discussion in this thread, a system is now decided on. Geoff has written up these results into the wiki, which I've duplicated here. Thanks for your help, and look out for the next design thread soon.

http://freeorion.org/index.php/0.4_Design_Pad#Ship_Designs

Slots
------
A ship hull has various "slots" in it that may have one or more ship parts placed in them.

Slots are characterized by:
* Size - Slots may be one of several sizes, such as "small", "medium", "large", etc. Ship parts have a size, and may only be placed in slots of equal or greater size. Multiple smaller parts may be placed in larger slots (specifics to be determined).
* Internal / External - Some parts (including some specific weapons or engines) may only be placed in external slots. Other parts may only be placed in internal slots. Other parts can be placed anywhere. External slots are more prone to being damaged by weapons fire hitting the ship.
* Facing - External slots are located on a particular side, or facing, of a ship. The facing of an external slot may affect the function of parts placed in it, such as by limiting the directions in which a weapon can fire. Facing may also affect the liklihood of a part being damaged by weapons hitting the ship from the facing direction.

Hull Shape
-------------
There may be various differently-shaped hulls of the same size. Different shapes of hull will have different numbers, sizes and configurations of slots, while having overall about the same total space for parts. One shape might have fewer larger slots, and another might have more smaller slots. Alternatively, there might be more forward facing large slots on one shape, and more internal and side-facing large slots on another shape.

Shapes might also have characteristics that directly affect ship performance, similar to sizes, or may not.


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