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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 9:55 pm 
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Here is another attempt to add something like a strategic ressource special to fo:

Asteroid Coating

Effects: The Empire that controls an outpost or colony on an asteroid field with the Asteroid Coating special (and has the detection strength to see it) will get a structure bonus of +10% to all Asteroid hulls.

Stealth: 25 (normally needs Active Radar)

Spawning location: Any Asteroid field (but restricted to 1 or 2 per galaxy). Will be guarded by 2 Asteroid Snails if not too close to an empire's homeworld.

Description: These asteroids are infected by transdimensional worms that eat tunnels through the rock, leaving behind a sticky slime that seems to automatically spread over the whole surface of the affected asteroid and prevents it from breaking appart. Applied to ships build with asteroid hulls the slime will naturally increase their durability. While scientists were unable to reproduce the substance or catch a living worm, they found out that just a small amount of fresh slime is enough to enhance whole fleets.

Gameplay: I think it would be nice to research Active Radar and find out that a formerly invisible special is waiting just around the corner, or even better close to an opponent who hasn't discovered it yet. I'm not sure whether the bonus of +10% is too small (it should only affect the hull structure so it will be between 1.5 and 14), but it's free and will work like Reinforced Hull so should be usefull in all stages of the game.

Thoughts?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 7:46 am 
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Sloth wrote:
Gameplay: I think it would be nice to research Active Radar and find out that a formerly invisible special is waiting just around the corner, or even better close to an opponent who hasn't discovered it yet.

Hmm, yes, a part of me loves the idea that as you get better techs you find out about stuff that was previously hidden.

Thing is, when, for example, I research enough tech to reveal a Setinon, Furthest or Nymh homeworld they're immediately marked on the map (and if I've ever had a scout actually in the system the planet would be obscured and the name would be italicised).

Planetary specials aren't marked on the map thus you wouldn't know that it was there, and you could go the entire game never noticing that that system near your homeworld would've been giving you a significant bonus of some sort or another.

In this specific case, obviously, the presence of a couple Asteroid Snails would be a bit of a pointer but if we're going to have stealthy specials of some sort or another we need a way of informing players when they become visible.

Having said that, if some of the beneficial specials, including some of the existing ones, were hidden in the early game but became visible either when you've got enough detection or when you colonise it that could be interesting, a Sitrep announcing that the colonists on Planet Arakis 1 have discovered plentiful Ki Spice deposits would be a nice sitrep to get.

Whether it would need to be actually colonised or merely outposted I don't know, probably the latter, it would affect your species choice to some respects and could be rather cool.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:28 am 
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That's a good point Mat. A possible solution could be to add a list of specials to the Active Radar tech descriptions: "The bonus in detection strength should make the following specials visible: Asteroid Coating, ... . Make sure to check their pedia entries for known locations after researching".

MatGB wrote:
Having said that, if some of the beneficial specials, including some of the existing ones, were hidden in the early game but became visible either when you've got enough detection or when you colonise it that could be interesting, a Sitrep announcing that the colonists on Planet Arakis 1 have discovered plentiful Ki Spice deposits would be a nice sitrep to get.

Whether it would need to be actually colonised or merely outposted I don't know, probably the latter, it would affect your species choice to some respects and could be rather cool.
This could actually be scriptable. When the planet is owned by an empire, but the special is not visible to that empire, a SitRep could be generated to inform the empire of the special. The special would also lower its stealth when owned by an empire (hopefully this won't prevent the SitRep from ever being generated).

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:32 am 
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Sloth wrote:
The special would also lower its stealth when owned by an empire...
Note that that would make the special more visible to all empires, not just the empire that owns the planet.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 11:54 am 
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Geoff the Medio wrote:
Note that that would make the special more visible to all empires, not just the empire that owns the planet.
I don't see a problem with that.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 5:17 pm 
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Sloth wrote:
Geoff the Medio wrote:
Note that that would make the special more visible to all empires, not just the empire that owns the planet.
I don't see a problem with that.

Neither do I, it'd be a key merchant/export thing, the source'd be known fairly soon if it's being transported across an entire empire.

We could do it with all the growth specials, they're already heavily interlinked on the Pedia pages (because, um, I wanted to be able to find them more easily so I practiced my text macro writing on them).

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 7:43 pm 
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While trying to implement this special i encountered a problem with FOCS that i need some help with:

When the planet with the Asteroid Coating special is owned by an empire the stealth of the special is upposed to be reduced by -20. Sounds simple, but i haven't found a way to script the right scope!

I tried something like
Code:
scope = And [
                Source
                Special
                OwnedBy affiliation = AnyEmpire
            ]   

But apparently Special is not supported in this case.

Any ideas?

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 10:08 pm 
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Your script-fu is greater than mine, but why would you need to mention the special if the special is the source of the effect?

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 11:17 pm 
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Since specials are not exactly objects, source probably resolves to the object it is attached to. I'm not 100% certain on this, so it may need
Code:
ContainedBy
    Contains And [
        Planet
        HasSpecial name = "NAME_SPECIAL"
    ]

I'm guessing it should work as mat suggested though:
Code:
scope = Source
activation = OwnedBy affiliation = AnyEmpire


The Special token looks like it is limited to: start a definition, as a location type, or an items consumption definition.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2016 10:50 am 
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dbenage-cx wrote:
I'm guessing it should work as mat suggested though:
Code:
scope = Source
activation = OwnedBy affiliation = AnyEmpire

When scope = Source, the special will reduce the stealth of the planet (Asteroids) which is not intended.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2016 1:41 pm 
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Ah, you want to reduce the stealth of the special itself.

Um, specials can have stealth (the Derelict specials for example), but I've never messed around with it beyond that.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:27 am 
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I don't know of a way to return a special as the target/candidate. Maybe remove the existing special and add an alternative lower stealth special (two definitions).


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:52 am 
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dbenage-cx wrote:
I don't know of a way to return a special as the target/candidate. Maybe remove the existing special and add an alternative lower stealth special (two definitions).
That works. Thanks dbenage-cx.
PR has been created: https://github.com/freeorion/freeorion/pull/833

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:22 pm 
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Looks great.

Just to complicate things a bit ;)
What about applying the effect only to ships within supply range?
The effect would be to add a special to the ship, which increases structure as above.
Later on, this special could utilize capacity or be removed for some reason, requiring a return to supply range for "re-coat".


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:35 pm 
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dbenage-cx wrote:
What about applying the effect only to ships within supply range?
The effect would be to add a special to the ship, which increases structure as above.
It's currently implemented like Reinforced Hull. Asteroid hulls immediately get the bonus for max structure, but need to be "repaired" to actually get the bonus to current structure. Depending on the techs available this means visiting a drydock or be in supply range.

I would like to explore specials for ships at some point, but it would be nice if they would be displayed in the UI.

dbenage-cx wrote:
Later on, this special could utilize capacity or be removed for some reason, requiring a return to supply range for "re-coat".

This sounds like lots of micro-management.

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