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 Post subject: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:34 am 
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Space Floater
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Right now there is a choice when creating a game that allows you to choose species. There should be an information box that gives a brief blurb about that species - what facets differentiate it from the other species in the list. Peaceful/Warlike; bonuses to research, farming, production, health, whatever; and regardless of anything else, what type of planet is optimal for the race.

Right now, unless I choose terran/human, I haven't a clue what I am choosing, what makes it different, or what type of world is optimal for me to colonize.


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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:01 am 
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Seconded. I'm thinking of putting this info into the Quick Play Guide together with the wheel of types (from Roadmap).

Anyone knows how can I get the code for the wheel?


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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:17 pm 
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Right now, there isn't anything that distinguishes species from one another aside from EP, which is evident upon starting a game and glancing at your homeworld. Eventually though, galaxy setup will probably be split into multiple steps, with choosing (or customizing, as the case may be) your species being its own step, which will make it a lot easier to describe the differences between species in an easily readable way. Putting this information into the Quick Play guide would be appreciated though.

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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:48 pm 
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EP wheel diagrams are here:
viewtopic.php?p=46936#p46936

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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:04 pm 
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Bigjoe5 wrote:
Right now, there isn't anything that distinguishes species from one another aside from EP, which is evident upon starting a game and glancing at your homeworld. Eventually though, galaxy setup will probably be split into multiple steps, with choosing (or customizing, as the case may be) your species being its own step, which will make it a lot easier to describe the differences between species in an easily readable way. Putting this information into the Quick Play guide would be appreciated though.


Here is where I have a problem. It doesn't matter that "there isn't anything that distinguishes species from one another aside from EP" - someone decided to create multiple races and put the ability to choose between them in the code. The fact that all of the races are identical is irrelevant. If you add the ability to have multiple races, then you need to add an "information box that gives a brief blurb about that species" - even if the information presented in that box is currently the same for each species.

Also, "glancing at your homeworld" gives you an implied piece of information - which is sufficient for people who know all about the game. When you write a game, you should write it from the perspective of people who are interested in the topic, but know nothing about the game itself. The beginning player should always be assumed to be a "Beginning Player" - who won't know diddly about EP.

Think about it this way. Your brother/sister/friend loves Science Fiction but knows nothing about the game that you are designing. You sit them in front of the computer and say, "Play". What do they need in order to hook their interest within the first few minutes instead of having them say "I don't get it", then get up and walk away?


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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:06 pm 
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Fimbul_Fambi wrote:
Here is where I have a problem. It doesn't matter that "there isn't anything that distinguishes species from one another aside from EP" - someone decided to create multiple races and put the ability to choose between them in the code. The fact that all of the races are identical is irrelevant. If you add the ability to have multiple races, then you need to add an "information box that gives a brief blurb about that species" - even if the information presented in that box is currently the same for each species.

Also, "glancing at your homeworld" gives you an implied piece of information - which is sufficient for people who know all about the game. When you write a game, you should write it from the perspective of people who are interested in the topic, but know nothing about the game itself. The beginning player should always be assumed to be a "Beginning Player" - who won't know diddly about EP.

Think about it this way. Your brother/sister/friend loves Science Fiction but knows nothing about the game that you are designing. You sit them in front of the computer and say, "Play". What do they need in order to hook their interest within the first few minutes instead of having them say "I don't get it", then get up and walk away?

Well, yeah. Like I said, that information is going to be added in the future. Maybe now would be a good time to start creating some mock-ups for the race selection screen. In the meantime, the short-term non-ideal solution to the problem is to know that all races are identical except EP, and your species starts with the a homeworld corresponding to its EP.

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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:21 pm 
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Fimbul_Fambi wrote:
...Think about it this way. Your brother/sister/friend loves Science Fiction but knows nothing about the game that you are designing. You sit them in front of the computer and say, "Play". What do they need in order to hook their interest within the first few minutes instead of having them say "I don't get it", then get up and walk away?

I feel like you are complaining about the lack of a doorbell and doormat on a half-finished house that has neither door, windows, or roof, and where it hasn't been decided exactly where the front door will be.

While we are gradually progressing towards making FO fun to play in it's own right, i don't think you would be doing anybody favors if you introduced then to FO and they weren't already a big fan of the 4X genera, and willing to put up with the inconvenience of a half-formed game-- very much still under construction.

It's fine to point out what FO lacks, but don't expect "polish" to get a high priority.

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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:17 pm 
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I'm sorry if you feel that way, primarily because I recognize that all I can offer this project is feedback, not actual coding. And I recognize what you, and others on this project, have actually BUILT. It may seem like I am complaining about the lack of doorbell and doormat when there is no door, but I think that a different analogy is in order.

I think that it is more that I am complaining about a lack of hinges when someone decided to see what the house would look like with a door. Yes, I can push open the door without the hinges, but if you are going to add one, then you should add the other as well.

There are lots of times when someone wants to create a mock-up of a function to start fleshing out an area - and there is no problem with that. But on a team project, especially one where you are looking forward to input from the peanut gallery (and that is clearly where I am sitting) as well as other developers, I think that there is benefit to adding "Here there be Dragons" to locations where there are holes.

For example, someone decided (for whatever reason) to add multiple races to the game creation menu at this time. It is worth noting to everyone (through a dialog box that will later be used to describe racial characteristics) that all races are currently the same except that
1) each race does currently have its own homeworld EP
2) Terraforming doesn't work for any race except Terrans and Trith

You are right about "polish" but to use another analogy, I think that this is more about planing the door so that it doesn't stick when you close it, rather than about what color stain you use on the wood.


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 Post subject: Re: Start of game species information
PostPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 12:35 am 
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Fimbul_Fambi wrote:
...I recognize that all I can offer this project is feedback, not actual coding.

You might be interested and able to do some of this:
viewtopic.php?p=47729#p47729

It is more or less the precursor to the information you want to see in those tool-tips.

Fimbul_Fambi wrote:
It is worth noting to everyone (through a dialog box that will later be used to describe racial characteristics) that all races are currently the same except that
1) each race does currently have its own homeworld EP
2) Terraforming doesn't work for any race except Terrans and Trith

That information can be added to the wiki player's guide without any coding.

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