DESIGN: Economy Details for v.2

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drek
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DESIGN: Economy Details for v.2

#1 Post by drek » Mon Jul 21, 2003 4:43 am

Ok, this is the mildly important one.

We need to fill out the details of the economy system so that it can be included in v.2. There are a myraid of issues, so this thread might get a bit messy. To help keep it focused, let's not dicuss any new ideas for totally different economy system.

* We need the final numbers. Review the economy system here: http://www.artclusta.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=122 We need to define numbers for:

- The effects of the various focuses (both major and minor)
- The consumption of resources (food mostly for v.2, but it would be nice to start getting some idea on the scale on which industry, minerals, and research is spent.)

View http://www.drektopia.com/FreeOrion.xls for example numbers.

* Changing focus (from say Farming to Mining): should it cost anything? What should it cost? (Turns, money, 50 clicks on a sponser's advertisement banner?)

* Shipping resources to planets with shortfalls. It happens automatically, but should it cost anything?

* What are the effects of enviroment on resource collection? Remember the big bad Wheel of EP is in the game--the effects should be based off the wheel.

* The nature of money. Should we have money in the game? How is it earned?

The idea here is to combine all these factors into an economy system that actually works (with hard numbers). Because this is for v.2, we can't include technologies or facilities (they are slated for v.3).

Sooner or later, I'll post a complete system of my own.

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Thumper
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#2 Post by Thumper » Mon Jul 21, 2003 4:59 am

I've covered a lot of this in my Build Queue Manager... now I just need a way to get it posted for DL and viewing.

Thumper

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Impaler
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#3 Post by Impaler » Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:41 am

I would say thumbs down on trading "money" between two different races, though each race may have its own form of money and use it for internal purposes the trading of money between races sounds rather silly. Some alien races might be using all kinds of things as money, rare metals, pets, jewlery, britly colored coral, polished insect carpapaces (humm that sounds like a good idea for one of our races).

The point is its not very PLAUSABLE (I will be using the P word in place of the R word from now on as the R word offends NightFish).

It might be wise to go with the SMAC solution of making Energy the currency. I think making energy an inportant resorce in the game is an excelent idea and would add a lot of plausability. I would imagine that energy gets exchanged by huge lasers that can beam energy from one system too another, or possibly they use some kind of Quantum tunneling effect that we say is simple and discoverable by all races early in the game and facilitates energy exchanges.
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Nightfish
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#4 Post by Nightfish » Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:48 am

Impaler: How come you are always concerned with little technicallities like the names of stuff? What does it matter if we call it money or energy? (Spies or Hackers) I can see several ways why several races would accept money from each other. I can buy stuff from america, too, though they have a different currency. Same thing applies to our intergalactic money.

And just fyi, renaming realism plausibility that doesn't change the annoyance level of it *g*

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Tyreth
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#5 Post by Tyreth » Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:58 am

Impaler, it doesn't matter at all if we have trading between races. Fine, maybe a badger on earth doesn't care if I give him a 5cent coin or a two dollar coin.

If one race wants toy trains for their currency, and another wants pyramid shaped leaves, then fine. They'll simply work out a reasonable exchange rate. There is no problem. If you think it's a serious problem, then we can just say we work on the assumption that all races in the FreeOrion universe value money (whether they have their own currency or share one with other races).

Maybe I'm not explaining myself well, but at any rate - there is no problem with plausibility of races trading money. Money is merely a convenient way of shifting material goods and power, it is something that contains the promise of "you can exchange this for something you want".

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PowerCrazy
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#6 Post by PowerCrazy » Mon Jul 21, 2003 9:37 am

It doesn't matter what you call the currency, currency is simply a medium of exchange DONE. Ok next. I say that a unit of population should consume 2 units of food. And that a non-specialized world should have each person produce 4 units base modified by both positive and negative modifiers. Such as position on the EP wheel, possibly gravity, and of course eventually technology. That way at the beginning of the game when all you have is your homeworld you'll be forced to have about half of your population on food production.

Also I think it should be cheaper to go from a farming planet to an industry planet than vice-versa. It would seem to me that with the current system your first couple of colonies would be food specialized planets, and then you might throw some industry and mineral planets. and very rarely you'd have a science planet.
Aquitaine is my Hero.... ;)

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utilae
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Re: DESIGN: Economy Details for v.2

#7 Post by utilae » Mon Jul 21, 2003 10:09 am

drek wrote: * Changing focus (from say Farming to Mining): should it cost anything? What should it cost? (Turns, money, 50 clicks on a sponser's advertisement banner?)
A cost would make things interesting. It should take X turns to change from food to mining. Depending on the loyality of the people X could be less. Morale should also be taken into account, ie change your peoples jobs too much and they would get sick of it.
drek wrote: * Shipping resources to planets with shortfalls. It happens automatically, but should it cost anything?
It should not cost anything, although depending how many turns it takes to get to it's destination, it may cost lives, perhaps.
drek wrote: * The nature of money. Should we have money in the game? How is it earned?
Energy credits seems like a cool currency idea. But obviously realism is starting to play an effect here. Of course we will have money of some sort, whether it's rocks, teeth or energy credits. I think having buildings specialising in bringing in money is a good way for it to be earned.

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Bastian-Bux
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#8 Post by Bastian-Bux » Mon Jul 21, 2003 10:38 am

Well, I#d suggest information as a currency instead of energy. That makes definitely more sense :). So the currency could be RP.

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Thumper
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#9 Post by Thumper » Mon Jul 21, 2003 11:14 am

What the actual medium is that is used for the Empire's Monitary Units are totally beside the point. The Empire is going to track trades via computer transactions anyway. So trading in camel dung, fire crackers, or sparklers is just too much detail to worry about. Lets just KISS this and call the darn things EMUs ... Empire Monitary Units... and then shorten that to just MUs.

Thumper

Looking to trade two broken and chipped fingernails and one stubbed toe for a five year supply of Senatorial hot air. (Prefferably without the gas bag attached at the tme of the trade.)

Thumper

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Nightfish
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#10 Post by Nightfish » Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:33 pm

Actually we had this discussion at least once before and decided to call the currency Aquitaine Units, or AU for short.

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Aquitaine
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#11 Post by Aquitaine » Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:39 pm

There is a suspicious lack of smileys in Nightfish's post, s I'll add them. Aquitaine Units :P :P :P :roll:
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Nightfish
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#12 Post by Nightfish » Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:44 pm

There are no smileys because I'm dead serious! Really, let's call them Aquitaine Units. Why the heck not? :wink:

drekmonger
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#13 Post by drekmonger » Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:58 pm

Actually I was thinking we might use Minerals as currency, rather than add a new resource. I'm cool with AUs too. :P

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Thumper
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#14 Post by Thumper » Mon Jul 21, 2003 12:59 pm

I think you missed my point. Its not even important what you call them. It IS important to have them! :D

I seem to have missed that discussion too. :(

Thumper

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Nightfish
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#15 Post by Nightfish » Mon Jul 21, 2003 1:10 pm

drekmonger wrote:Actually I was thinking we might use Minerals as currency, rather than add a new resource. I'm cool with AUs too. :P
Nah, minerals as currency aren't cool. We do need a separate sort of money. Speaking of minerals: We never really said what they'd do. Do you need minerals for everything you build or just ships and orbitals? (Which is what I'd sort of prefer).

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