Monsters

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wobbly
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Monsters

#1 Post by wobbly »

Noticed the white kraken doesn't have a tentacle attack. Also White and Black Krakens don't have a jaw attack. I definitely think white krakens should get the tentacle attack, maybe a jaw as well? Should black kraken lose a spine attack and gain a jaw attack?
Last edited by wobbly on Fri Jul 29, 2022 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

wobbly
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Re: Krakens

#2 Post by wobbly »

Ok I'll just go ahead and add the tentacle attack of great kraken to white kraken and chance of guard 1 to the kraken in the ice special. Currently this is unguarded.

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Oberlus
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Re: Krakens

#3 Post by Oberlus »

+1

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LienRag
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Re: Krakens

#4 Post by LienRag »

The white kraken is unguarded because it's stealthy.
And it should stay that way.

wobbly
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Re: Krakens

#5 Post by wobbly »

LienRag wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 6:34 pm The white kraken is unguarded because it's stealthy.
Yeah missed that. Thanks. I'll just give it a tentacle.

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Re: Monsters

#6 Post by wobbly »

So ah.. why don't snowflakes have solar concentrators?

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Re: Monsters

#7 Post by Ophiuchus »

wobbly wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 1:35 pm So ah.. why don't snowflakes have solar concentrators?
Good catch. Sounds more than reasonable
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wobbly
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Re: Monsters

#8 Post by wobbly »

Ophiuchus wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:43 am
wobbly wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:41 am krakens could have stealth boost on GGs
+1 (not sure how it balances, but id like to try)
Copying relevant part from another thread

wobbly
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Re: Monsters

#9 Post by wobbly »

wobbly wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 1:35 pm So ah.. why don't snowflakes have solar concentrators?
Sidenote. I'm not seeing:

[SHIP_WEAPON_DAMAGE_FACTOR]

on the solar concentrators. Missing?

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Oberlus
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Re: Monsters

#10 Post by Oberlus »

wobbly wrote: Thu Aug 11, 2022 4:04 pm I'm not seeing:

[SHIP_WEAPON_DAMAGE_FACTOR]

on the solar concentrators. Missing?
Good catch!

I guess it could be placed within the SOLAR_CONCENTRATOR_EFFECT macro?

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Re: Monsters

#11 Post by wobbly »

Note to self that snowflake slots need fixing, its currently trying to put the solar concentrator in the wrong slot type.

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Re: Monsters

#12 Post by wobbly »

wobbly wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 6:57 am Kraken in the Ice/White Kraken. I got the white kraken down on turn 64, as I took my time. However I had the detection strength to see it by turn 9, it was unguarded 3 jumps from my capital and it has enough fuel range that I could of basically just parked it on o01eg's capital and said "try and play now".

Edit: For reference the earliest a kraken can appear is turn 30, the earliest a great kraken can appear is turn 60.
Oberlus wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 7:57 am Yeah. kraken in the Ice unguarded is quite bad for balance (unless every player has one near his HW).
Kraken nests are also quite of a problem when they are not distrubuted uniformly (and they aren't). Could their acquisition be delayed a bit more, and their monster production when unowmed be increased a bit? That way, if you have a kraken nest near your HW, it will be more of a liability until acquired. The current state in which if you rush to it you can get a great advantage in combat is annoying in MP.
Daybreak wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:31 am
wobbly wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 3:04 am White Kraken could have its stealth increase to say Sensor level before you can see it.
It actually becomes near useless at that stage of the game, due to its rotten speed.
Yes true - tricky
Current stealth is 25. Current minimum distance is not within 2 jumps of capital.

Suggested change: stealth = 45, not within 4 jumps.

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Oberlus
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Re: Monsters

#13 Post by Oberlus »

wobbly wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 7:24 am Current stealth is 25. Current minimum distance is not within 2 jumps of capital.

Suggested change: stealth = 45, not within 4 jumps.
+1

Regarding monster spawning rate from nests, the problem I see is that having a per-turn chance (0.05 IIRC) of creating one monster can produce great luck differences. I once got 3 krakens in 5 turns from the same nest (chances were 11 in a million), and I often get no krakens in 20 turns in a row (chances are 36%, or 64% of getting at least one kraken every 20 turns), and I remember once not getting a single kraken from two nests for more than 30 turns.
I think it would be easier to balance krakens (and other monsters) if their spawning rate could be more controlled. If average/expected spawning rate is around (say) one kraken every 16 turns, then nests should not spawn more than one kraken every 8 turns and no less than one kraken every 32.

Another factor to consider is the huge structure these beasts have when they mature. In current MP game, turn 78, how many mature krakens has Ophiuchus. My empire has several planets set to production, Adaptive Automation on time, but on average a bad start with few colonization oportunities and no nearby natives (except in the area contested with Ophiuchus). He obviously should have a greater fleet than me, but current numbers are a bit ridiculous, he has like 3x or 4x my total fleet structure, and enough damage output to crash my fleets, my multiplanet systems, etc. (my only hope is that LienRag doesn't play as well as Ophiuchus would do).

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Grummel7
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Re: Monsters

#14 Post by Grummel7 »

Maturing could be changed easily: The chance could depend on the age of the monster. E.g. it cannot mature in its first 5 turns, then the chance becomes 2% in turn 6, increased by 2% each turn. Of course maturing still requires the monster to be in a suitable location. It also makes sense that older monster have a better chance to mature.

Spawning is a bit trickier, but I guess adding an invisible special to the nest planet could give the nest some memory. So the actual spawning change would depend on the age of that special and it is replaced whenever a monster spawns.

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Re: Monsters

#15 Post by Daybreak »

wobbly wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 7:24 am Current stealth is 25. Current minimum distance is not within 2 jumps of capital.

Suggested change: stealth = 45, not within 4 jumps.
+1 as well, although why not within 8 jumps. To me, not within 4 jumps would still be very close.
Oberlus wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 8:08 am I think it would be easier to balance krakens (and other monsters) if their spawning rate could be more controlled. If average/expected spawning rate is around (say) one kraken every 16 turns, then nests should not spawn more than one kraken every 8 turns and no less than one kraken every 32.
+1
I think this is definitely better than increasing unowned spawning and decreasing owned spawning.

However I would like to see this only applied to owned spawning, and keep current spawning rates for unowned, to still make it a little harder to capture the kraken nest.

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