DESIGN: Production Category

[Aquitaine]

This thread contains guided discussion for the contents of the Production category. It is moderated by <_your name here_>.

Specific rules for this thread as set by the moderator are as follows:

I'm going to experiment with using the Wiki to develop this category and then use this as a discussion thread. I should be able to set up some preliminary stuff in the Wiki this weekend.

[Aquitaine]

My apologies for being behind on this thread! Every time I plan a day to sit down and work on FO, something crazy happens. I will be spending some time on this during the week.

But to start us off, here's a general feel for what this category will be doing, as indicated by the relevant Effects variables (may be some crossover with Construction, but hopefully we can minimize that and make them as distinct as possible)

http://www.freeorion.org/wiki/index.php ... troduction

CurrentIndustry
MaxIndustry
CurrentMining
MaxMining
CurrentPopulation (these two are more the 'growth' category's province,
MaxPopulation but they might appear here)
MineralProduction
IndustryProduction

To start off with, I want to keep these techs very simple. I have no illusions that what we do here will be anything close to the final version. We can't anticipate how ship design and combat and races and espionage and added specials will affect this category (or any other), so let's not try to, and keep an open mind towards revision.

I will start a Wiki for this category this week sometime that will keep the current 'updated' version of this category. What I'd like to do in this thread is talk about the limited variety we can achieve given the subset of the overall conditions and effects we have at the moment.

[skdiw]

Theory: Robtics
Description: The use of automated aids dramatically increase the efficiency of mining and production.

Application: Robotic Factory
Description: A fully automated robotic facotory fully equiped with its own feeback control mechanism, power generators, and assembly line.
Effect: MaxIndustry +1

Refinement: Manufactoring Nexus
Description: A massive fully integrated manufactoring metropolis
Effect: Empire wonder "Manufacturing Nexus" + 10 CurrentIndustry and MaxIndustry, half effect for neighboring systems

Application: Deep Core Mining
Description: Allows digging of rare minerials only found in high pressures and temperature of the core of a planet
Effect: CurrentMining +1

Refinement: Deep Star Mining
Description: Similar to Deep Core Mining, except mining of even harsher environments of stars possible.
Effect: Current Mining+1
Prereq.: Deep Core Mining

Refinement: Black Hole Mining
Description: Magically extracts minerals from black holes
Effect Current Mining +1
Prereq. Black Hole Mining

Refinement: Deep Space Mining
Description: Transfroms dark matter into usable forms.
Effect: Current Mining +2
Prereq. Black Hole Mining

End Game Tech: Localized Matter Waves
Description: By resonnating the same wave vector as the matter itself, it is possible to colesce neighboring matter waves into a single large matter. With an appropriate oscillator, it is possible to condense all matters within many light years away into one single location. Furthermore, it is possible to direct matter waves from any point in space to the Matter Oscillator.
Effect: MaxIndustry +1, Galactic Wonder "Matter Oscillator": This planet's MaxIndustry + 10*number of planets within 50 parsec of this wonder, while enemy's empire MaxIndustry -10 within in 50 parsec of this wonder.

[utilae]

Mineral Purification (Application)
+2 Max Mining
+2 Mineral Production
"By focusing an intense warp field, minerals can be transformed into far richer and more pure minerals, greatly increasing the mineral quality of minerals mined."

AI Construction Ships (Application)
+5 MaxIndustry
+2 Industry Production
Prerequisites: AI Theory
"Constructing space structures such as spacestations and ships is a difficult task. AI Construction Ships are small AI controlled space ships that are able to travel through space with ease and aid in building space structures.

[Prokonsul Piotrus]

I will use this tech to see if I have a correct grasp of XML and our current syntax thingy. My bet is that I don't, but here it goes. Oh, I am not touching res cost and time since I have *absolutely no idea* what the correct values should be.

<Tech>
<name>Nanoalchemy</name>
<description>'Take 79 hydrogens atoms. Get 1 gold. Alchemy was once viewed as science, then dethroned into pseudoscience. Now it is back to the begining. I am sure ancient alchemist would appreciate that irony'
- interview with Li Kanji, Transmutation Ltd. Chief Researcher

By using nanobots to deconstruct and construct atoms demselves, anything can be transmuted into anything, making mining extremly cheap and easy, as development of advancement mining techniques and search for rare minearls becoems almost unnecessary.</description>
<type>TT_APPLICATION</type>
<category>PRODUCTION</category>
<research_cost>RESEARCH_COST</research_cost>
<research_turns>RESEARCH_TURNS</research_turns>
<prerequisites>
Nanorobotics
</prerequisites>
<unlocked_items>
Exotic Atom Materials
Warfare Nanoalchemy
Alchemy Economics
</unlocked_items>
<EffectsGroup>
<effects>
<Effect::SetMeter>
<meter>METER_MINING</meter>
<value>?</value>
<max>?</max>
</Effect::SetMeter>
<Effect::SetMeter>
<meter>METER_MINING</meter>
<value>?</value>
<max>?</max>
</Effect::SetMeter>
</effects>
</EffectsGroup>

Notes:
I'd like for this tech to double MaxMining and CurrentMining, but I don't know how to put it in XML lingo, so for now I left the question marks where I think something should be :>
All nano based techs are potentialy gamebreaking. Perhaps we should have sth like 'nano catastrophy' risk (i.e. nano goes berseks and eats entire planet etc.) increasing with those techs akin to AI rebellion idea?

[drek]

Pretty close. Take a look at my techs at the end of the construction thread.

You'll want to make name and description variables that are defined on a string table. And you'll want to read the EffectsGroup thingy on the wiki--you got that completely wrong.

[Geoff the Medio]

Take 79 hydrogens atoms. Get 1 gold.

Better make that 197 hydrogen atoms, Kanji. Don't forget the neutrons, unless you're using deuterium.

I like the idea of using SMAC-like in-character tech descriptions... though this should probably be discussed on the story board.

By using nanobots to deconstruct and construct atoms demselves...

Should probably call these "picobots" or something... "the next step beyond nanobots". I don't think mere nanobots would have much luck taking apart atoms.

I'd like for this tech to double MaxMining and CurrentMining, but I don't know how to put it in XML lingo, so for now I left the question marks where I think something should be :>

Code: Select all

    <Effect::SetMeter>
        <meter>METER_MINING</meter>
        <value>Target.MaxMining * 2</value>
        <max>1</max>
    </Effect::SetMeter>

Don't alter CurrentMining in a tech, and I strongly suggest not altering MaxMining using a multiplier. Use +1 to +4 or so.

[Aquitaine]

SMAC-style stuff is great, but we should probably hold off on it for now until the story and the races are more developed.

[Geoff the Medio]

Ok, similar to Learning, and just like Economics, here's my initial list of Tree Trunk Theories for the Production category.

The idea behind these techs is that the Production category covers ways to produce more and mine more, which includes power generation. This does not include anything about new materials or architecture or new designs for things to build.

Microgravity Manufacturing
Interstellar Co-Production
Planetary Geology
Fusion Generation
Cyborg / Robotic Production
Asteroid Mining
Nanotech Production
Deep-Core Extraction
Singularity Generation
Force-Field Assembly
Self-Gravitating Production
Psychokinetic Assembly
Molecular Recombination
N-Dimensional Assembly
Matter-Energy Replication
Zero-Point Generation

These are roughly in order from earlier to later, but not strictly / precisely so.

Thoughts? Omissions? Redundancies? Stupidities?

[utilae]

You have a few theory's that are the same as in other categories, eg
N-Dimensional Assembly
Matter-Energy Replication

I think we need a few more extreme production techs, more to do with mass mass mass production. And production of parts that combine into a larger object. Maybe even something to do with shipyards. Producing objects larger than planets, etc.

[Geoff the Medio]

You have a few theory's that are the same as in other categories, eg
N-Dimensional Assembly
Matter-Energy Replication

Those are the psueudo-theory-applications of Matter-Energy Conversion and N-Dimensional Subspace. They're not the same though... They are a more specialized type of theory... similar to the Force-Field Harmonics tech, which would unlock Defensive Energy Shields in a Ships category, maybe some kind of Energy Architcture in Construction and the Force-Field Assembly tech in Production. The Assembly and Replication techs you mentioned specifically would have the similar-sounding techs from Learning as prerequisites.

I think we need a few more extreme production techs, more to do with mass mass mass production.

By this do you mean building lots and lots of the same thing, or building really really big things? I have Self-Gravitating Production for the latter... and the former would presumably just mean building more factories... what special new insight do you need to do that?

I suppose we could add another extra-super-big production tech, though we need to be careful not to move too far into Construction territory... The idea is that Production techs increase your PP, while Construction determines what you can build. Self-Gravitating Production and Microgravity Manufacturing are already a bit too far into the Construction category (they could be called Self-Gravitating / Microgravity Construction, really)... It sounds like the additions want are more appropriate for Construction as well...

One thing that could be added that would be squarely in the Production category would be something more about having your various planets in various starsystems work together better... more specialization for each and better ways to move production from one planet to another. There's already Interplanetary Co-Production, but something more later could be added... Suggestions?

And production of parts that combine into a larger object.

That doesn't strike me as particularly advanced... We do that now... Though I suppose it could be phrased in a way that makes it sound like a whole order of magnitude more elaborate... like Planetary Modularity, or somesuch...

Maybe even something to do with shipyards. Producing objects larger than planets, etc.

These are more appropriate for Construction, as I see it. Both let you build a new type of object, whereas I'm focusing Production on producing more or faster. Alternatively, shipyards stuff could be in a ships category...

[Geoff the Medio]

First draft of Production theory tree trunk...

[utilae]

Good. What about some production related things for producing organic objects.

And what about 'self replicating manufacturing system' or 'self aware factories', etc.

Maybe even something to do with altering time to increase production rate.

[Geoff the Medio]

What about some production related things for producing organic objects.

*sigh* See, this is why I made up a list of techs before I made it into a tree...

I suppose these techs would have prerequisites in Growth... which is good. How about adding an "Organic Production Enhancement" 1st tier tech, and making Nanotech Production have it as a prerequisite, and making the various organic-specific techs all under that category as applications? The actual theory would be 1st tier, but most of the applications would require upper tier theories from other categories as well. It doesn't seem like there'd be enough different organic production things to warrant more than one or two theories... Though feel free to suggest some.

And what about 'self replicating manufacturing system' or 'self aware factories', etc.

How about we get rid of Psychokinetic Production, add a few applications to Force-Field Production with Psionics as a prerequisite, and make a "Sentient Autofactories" or somesuch tech that has Nanotech Production as a prerequisite. Singularity Generation and N-Dimensional Production would have it as a prerequisite.

Maybe even something to do with altering time to increase production rate.

This could be under Sentient Autofactories as applications. You'd need Temporal Mechanics from Learning and in some cases N-Dimensional Construction from Consruction. You'd make a factory (optionally in a pocket dimension with N-Dim. C.) that could effectively instantly transform any materials you put in into whatever you wanted... Presumably you could alter the flow of time more in the pocket dimension, so the applications requiring N-Dim. Const. would be an order of magnitude more powerful than those just needing Temp. Mech. which operate in our universe, but sped up somewhat.

Note: The distincion between N-Dimensional Production and N-Dimensional Construction is that N-Dom. Prod is about directly altering the internal structure of a 3D object without disturbing its surface, and N-Dim Const. is about building things inside Pocket Dimensions.

Note to Self: Perhaps under Transcendental Architecture, we could have some applications requiring N-Dim. Const. that allow actual 4D+ architecture.

[Geoff the Medio]

New version...


Something about Organic Building growth might be added later, or could be applications under Transforming Structures.

The latter might need a slight renaming actually... it's a combination of mechanical and biological reconfiguration of structures... and it would be nice if it also seemed to cover growth of organic structures as well... or maybe that's just too much for one theory...

Edit: Deleted Transmutation, moved Matter-Energy Replication back to its place. The two seemed rather redundant, and there's too many theories in this category anyway.