Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

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Oberlus
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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#46 Post by Oberlus »

Species stability trait is still off the range. It is -5, 0, +5, +10. Would make sense if (or will make sense once) the stability of colonies early game, before policies and distance-from-capital malus, is around 10. Currently, it makes Bad Stability species to be under 5 until you get nice stability boosts.
If we find some species are too handicapped/overpowered or any other source of unbalance, I won't mind restarting the game after committing some fixes (actually, I'd prefer restarting as many times as needed and as soon as possible).

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#47 Post by Ophiuchus »

So I got Sly and found accesible gas giants around. I am also able to connect one to my homeworld (if not choosing centralization).

Stealth is mostly broken so I cant extend as much as possible in the beginning, so rather slowly explore/expand.

Going for an early homeworld grab is not really feasable for Sly, so that mid-term strategy is rather off the table.

So, what to go for....

Settling disconnected will be ok stability wise without any policy even for robotic production. A single colony on influence will produce more influence than it costs.

If I go for centralisation I get like 2PP and 2RP but wont be able to settle further because of prohibitive influence costs - not being able to connect any colony to the homeworld.

For a social slot I could get 2RP per colony (liberty) OR 2RP and maybe a bit more on the capital (algorithmic elegance) OR quite a lot stability, 5 troops and 1IP per disconnected colony (confederation) OR 5IP (propaganda) OR 70% cost of colony parts (so i could build about almost 3 colony ships for the price of 2).
It sounds either like propaganda or liberty. If I value RP as high as IP, liberty makes sense if I have at least 3 colonies (or 4 if i have clunky stability). If I have at least 5 disconnected colonies, switching from propaganda to confederation makes sense.

For liberty and algorithmic elegance i need stability 8, in both cases I need some extra source of stability to get there (i should be able to get the 8 stability for liberty, but it has a -2 stability effect if the research boost kicks in, so I expect it would work only every second turn (?))


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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#48 Post by Oberlus »

I'm Abaddoni. One tiny inferno in my HW system, didn't find anything else good or adequate for now. No interesting specials, nor monster nests or natives either. I'm going for Propaganda and the +5 IP per turn, ignoring Centralization (the cost of colonization ship parts is increased by 50%, I didn't know that), and later I'll get the infrastructure policies (first one is 30 IP). I hope I can find some fat planet to burrow.

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#49 Post by o01eg »

I'm Egassem and found some suitable planets near so first I'm going to populate them.
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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#50 Post by wobbly »

I am the mighty humans, all will perish before the might of my frigates. Got a medium terrain close by. Policy decisions will have to wait, I'm taking the long road to the slot e.g. mind in the void

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#51 Post by The Silent One »

I also got the powerful humans, and there's an abundance of fertile planets closeby. Concerning policies I haven't the foggiest idea, so probably liberty.
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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#52 Post by wobbly »

Looking around I have a nice set of colonizable planets which settles my policy plan. Design simplicity, colonization, system architecture and colonial bootstrapping. My small colony has been set to influence.

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#53 Post by Oberlus »

I've got a few poor and hostile planets within my small universe pocked, enclosed by a maintenance ship and a sentry. So I'm building basic warships and refining my mass drivers to get out. I'll target first the sentry, losing one frigate, and see what can I find behind it. Not sure what I'll do with policies appart from Propaganda, Active Scanning and the infrastructure policies.

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#54 Post by wobbly »

Joke: What's funnier then an Oberlus trapped in a box.

Answer: Nothing. There is nothing funnier then an Oberlus trapped in a box.

You can actually stealth the basic symbiot through a maintainance ship if you get desperate. Though its a pain getting supply, you pretty much need a shielded ship blockading the system.

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#55 Post by Ophiuchus »

Is there any use for the extra stability provided by balance policy? Capital is always good on stability isnt it?

On psychological architecture: Balance wise it is not so good that the first social slot (which probably boosts IP) also provides the first(?) good IP source policy for the economic slots. I actually see some tradeoffs at this early stage between the different policies, so that is good (I am at 14,5 IP and probably want balance and liberty in the end, got me planetary infrastructure first, so I am loosing a turn or so because i dont have enough to adopt it right now).

Bootstrapping at this early stage "only" helps with stability and in a decreasing way - not sure how that plays out. Later on catching up with higher target meters is the main boon i guess. Anyone knows if it enable focus dance?

Also note snap channel latest/beta/slow-game-017 is open! This will follow the current version for our game (the beta channel follows the weekly builds).

I am not sure about the current gas giant generator effects. If i am right you get still most of if there is there is no colony on it. As its disliked I need some extra sources of stability to be able to use it on connected planets - but should be easy with federation on disconnected ones. Currently I am rather going connected.
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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#56 Post by Oberlus »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Oct 11, 2021 9:52 am Is there any use for the extra stability provided by balance policy? Capital is always good on stability isnt it?
Right. I think it could give a smaller bonus (or malus, depending on balance) to stability on all planets. Not sue about what could be the formula.
On psychological architecture: Balance wise it is not so good that the first social slot (which probably boosts IP) also provides the first(?) good IP source policy for the economic slots.
Yes, Psych. Arch. seems to me a must-have right now (it also unlocks the first social quite much faster than going for mind of the void).
Bootstrapping at this early stage "only" helps with stability and in a decreasing way - not sure how that plays out. Later on catching up with higher target meters is the main boon i guess.
Yes, only new colonies with big populations can benefit from this, so it seems even better for invasion late game than for newly-colonized planets.
Anyone knows if it enable focus dance?
Haven't checked that out.

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#57 Post by wobbly »

Oberlus wrote: Mon Oct 11, 2021 10:18 am
Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Oct 11, 2021 9:52 am
On psychological architecture: Balance wise it is not so good that the first social slot (which probably boosts IP) also provides the first(?) good IP source policy for the economic slots.
Yes, Psych. Arch. seems to me a must-have right now (it also unlocks the first social quite much faster than going for mind of the void).
Right, I think the balance point here, for the moment, is the slower to reach, mind in the void opens design simplicity. Have a read of this policy, that's every ship of asteroid or smaller size. It's insanely good.

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#58 Post by Oberlus »

Yes, you can build +25% more ships for the prize, including colony ships...

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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#59 Post by Ophiuchus »

I just recognized the combat policies FLANKING and CHARGE only work for the ship weapons, not fighters nor arc disruptors (also not special monster weapons). Probably that is wrong. The bonus is 1*scaling - for mass drivers this means 1/3rd vs mass drivers zero.

That would directly translate to 2/3*scaling for arc disruptors, but one could add a shot instead.

For flak one could also think of adding a shot, but it does not fit the theme so I rather wouldn't. Actually CHARGE could/should lower the number of flak shots.

For fighters strikers have a bit higher base damage than mass drivers (4 vs 3), so adding 1*scaling is rather conservative. If taking bombers (6)as a reference point, adding 2*scaling would keep the balance. So I'd suggest adding 2*scaling for all fighter types.

For monster weapons dunno.
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Re: Seventeenth game on the multiplayer slow game server

#60 Post by Oberlus »

Ophiuchus wrote: Mon Oct 11, 2021 7:05 pm I just recognized the combat policies FLANKING and CHARGE only work for the ship weapons, not fighters nor arc disruptors. Probably that is wrong.
A side note: being an absolute bonus (+6) instead of something that depends on ratio of allied ships over total ships in combat or level of the weapon, it seems quite good to prolong lifetime of early weapons. MD4 gets double damage for the prize, L4 gets +54.5%, P4 +33%, DR4 +20%. Pretty good for empires that go early military and less interesting for empires rushing research. For what I did in last game (less than ten warships built until I had DR and Titan), it would be a total waste of policy slot, even if I could get the bonus from attacking from two starlanes. I think it is quite balanced except maybe very early game if someone can pull it out.

The only think that really bugs me, but it is not important I think, is that it seems something I would put into a fleet toggle: it's about tactics in the battlefield, not about empire governance. But a toggle could be seen as micromanagement, I guess.

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