Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

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unjashfan
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Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#1 Post by unjashfan »

I'm playing the latest build (4547) as human and sometimes I see random famines on some of my planets when my entire empire is connected to the capital and I have farming surplus every turn. What does that mean?

Some buildings are also unavailable (even when unlocked. ex: solar accelerator) and some don't seem to work (megalith doesn't automatically override imperial palace; its effects to resource supply doesn't show). I'm wondering if I'm not setting up the game properly (I don't have SVN) because v0.3.17 by itself has everything I mentioned. I'll make a list of these techs/buildings if anyone wants me to (I don't want to make this post too long).

I'm new here, only recently started playing FreeOrion and I love this game. Kudos to all the staff for making this, thanks!! Hope I'll be able to help out with this project.

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#2 Post by Geoff the Medio »

unjashfan wrote:because v0.3.17 by itself has everything I mentioned.
Meaning v0.3.17 has those bugs, or all those bugs aren't present in v0.3.17?
I'll make a list of these techs/buildings if anyone wants me to (I don't want to make this post too long).
That would be helpful.

Several things have changed since v0.3.17, including a new parsing system that read in all the game content. It has several known issues, and likely several unknown issues. I've you've observed broken content since v0.3.17, a list would be useful to identify script problems or parser problems.

unjashfan
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#3 Post by unjashfan »

Meaning v0.3.17 has those bugs, or all those bugs aren't present in v0.3.17?
The bugs aren't in the original v0.3.17. So after downloading the build, certain functions disappeared. Certain techs such as the point defense techs were removed, but I am assuming it was on purpose.

Here's a list of techs/buildings that lost their function after installing the newest build (100% sure):
Buildings:
-Megalith (no longer overrides imperial palace, supply meters don't show the bonus from megalith and/or the bonus itself doesn't work)
-Solar rejuvenator
-Solar accelerator (both buildings disappeared, but the techs that unlock them are still available)
-Gas giant generator (industry meters don't list the bonus from this building, the bonus isn't listed under target industry, and/or the bonus itself doesn't work)
Techs and ship parts:
-Singularity of transcendence (doesn't seem to do anything; I have considered that victory messages haven't been implemented yet)
-Antimatter torpedo (only unlocks the engineering bay, but the upgrade itself doesn't exist)
-Plasma torpedo (same as above)
-Reconnaissance fighter (doesn't exist)

I still have yet to test play some other buildings. Ship-wise, the compressed energy hull starts with a detection of 300. I'm wondering if that's a typo or not because most standard ships have a detection of 30, and the upgraded energy hulls have less than the compressed energy hull. When I built a ship with that hull, a large section of the map revealed itself, so I thought it might be unintentional. Hope this helps.

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qsswin
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#4 Post by qsswin »

unjashfan wrote:
Buildings:
-Megalith (no longer overrides imperial palace, supply meters don't show the bonus from megalith and/or the bonus itself doesn't work)
-Solar rejuvenator
-Solar accelerator (both buildings disappeared, but the techs that unlock them are still available)
For these two, at least, see here: http://freeorion.svn.sourceforge.net/vi ... ision=4472 .
I guess the tech scripts and stringtable entries weren't correspondingly updated.

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#5 Post by Geoff the Medio »

qsswin wrote:I guess the tech scripts and stringtable entries weren't correspondingly updated.
The changes to the parser should mostly have no required related changes to the scripts, excluding a few cases where things were intentionally changed at the same time, but not due to the parser change.

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qsswin
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#6 Post by qsswin »

Geoff the Medio wrote:
qsswin wrote:I guess the tech scripts and stringtable entries weren't correspondingly updated.
The changes to the parser should mostly have no required related changes to the scripts, excluding a few cases where things were intentionally changed at the same time, but not due to the parser change.
Log Message wrote:Support for arithmetic expressions involving non-numeric types was removed (e.g. System.StarType + 1 now produces an error). Due to this change, a couple of as-yet unused buildings were removed (BLD_SOL_ACCEL and BLD_SOL_REJUV).
So those, at least, were changed due to the parser change.
unjashfan wrote:
Meaning v0.3.17 has those bugs, or all those bugs aren't present in v0.3.17?
The bugs aren't in the original v0.3.17. So after downloading the build, certain functions disappeared. Certain techs such as the point defense techs were removed, but I am assuming it was on purpose.

Here's a list of techs/buildings that lost their function after installing the newest build (100% sure):
Buildings:
-Megalith (no longer overrides imperial palace, supply meters don't show the bonus from megalith and/or the bonus itself doesn't work)
-Solar rejuvenator
-Solar accelerator (both buildings disappeared, but the techs that unlock them are still available)
-Gas giant generator (industry meters don't list the bonus from this building, the bonus isn't listed under target industry, and/or the bonus itself doesn't work)
Techs and ship parts:
-Singularity of transcendence (doesn't seem to do anything; I have considered that victory messages haven't been implemented yet)
-Antimatter torpedo (only unlocks the engineering bay, but the upgrade itself doesn't exist)
-Plasma torpedo (same as above)
-Reconnaissance fighter (doesn't exist)

I still have yet to test play some other buildings. Ship-wise, the compressed energy hull starts with a detection of 300. I'm wondering if that's a typo or not because most standard ships have a detection of 30, and the upgraded energy hulls have less than the compressed energy hull. When I built a ship with that hull, a large section of the map revealed itself, so I thought it might be unintentional. Hope this helps.
I'm looking at the Megalith script right now, and it seems there is a StackingGroup that has either the construction meter go up or the other ones. Why is this? Also, this is the code in Imperial Palace about the megalith:
57 activation = Not Number low = 1 And [
58 Building "BLD_MEGALITH"
59 OwnedBy TheEmpire Source.Owner
60 ]
Should there be another Not?

For the Gas Giant generator, are you sure you have focus set on industry?

About Singularity of Transcendence, yes, victory does nothing as of yet (there's some thread on the forum where Geoff says this, I can't find the quote right now).

The torpedoes were removed in the re-haul of weapons done (sorry, I can't find the thread again).

The Reconnaissance fighter probably won't exist until 3d combat is actually made, since fighters will probably be useless before...

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#7 Post by Geoff the Medio »

qsswin wrote:I'm looking at the Megalith script right now, and it seems there is a StackingGroup that has either the construction meter go up or the other ones. Why is this?
The first effects group acts on the planet (and system) that contains the Megalith building itself. The second acts on objects owned by the empire that owns the Megalith, which probably includes the planet that contains the Megalith. The stacking group is used to avoid stacking the construction meter bonuses.
Also, this is the code in Imperial Palace about the megalith:
57 activation = Not Number low = 1 And [
58 Building "BLD_MEGALITH"
59 OwnedBy TheEmpire Source.Owner
60 ]
Should there be another Not?
That's saying the effectsgroup is active if there are not one or more megalith buildings owned by the appropriate empire. Where would an additional Not go?

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qsswin
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#8 Post by qsswin »

Geoff the Medio wrote:
Also, this is the code in Imperial Palace about the megalith:
57 activation = Not Number low = 1 And [
58 Building "BLD_MEGALITH"
59 OwnedBy TheEmpire Source.Owner
60 ]
Should there be another Not?
That's saying the effectsgroup is active if there are not one or more megalith buildings owned by the appropriate empire. Where would an additional Not go?
I'm sorry, I was just tired at the time. I'm not really certain what I was thinking.

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#9 Post by Geoff the Medio »

qsswin wrote:For the Gas Giant generator, are you sure you have focus set on industry?
From the gas giant generator's script:

Code: Select all

    effectsgroups =
        EffectsGroup
            scope = And [
                ContainedBy Contains Source
                Focus "FOCUS_INDUSTRY"
            ]
            activation = Focus "FOCUS_INDUSTRY"
            effects = SetTargetIndustry Value + Target.Population * 0.25
So yes, you need to set the planet's focus to industry to get any bonus from the gas giant generator, because the effect only acts on planets with focus industry that are in the same system as the planet with the generator on it, and because the effect is only active if the planet with the generator on it has focus industry. So, both the planet with the generator and the planet to receive the bonus need to have focus industry.

bastion
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#10 Post by bastion »

Geoff the Medio wrote:
qsswin wrote:So, both the planet with the generator and the planet to receive the bonus need to have focus industry.
I thought gas giants were supposed to be uninhabitable outposts. Unable to have industry focus due to their small population.
Looking at the code I can see a special exception to enable industry focus if a generator is present. But this isn't mentioned in BLD_GAS_GIANT_GEN_DESC, and FOCUS_INDUSTRY_DESC seems to be missing completely.

I would suggest removing the need for focus industry from the gas giant. As this would make the game more intuitive (solar/black hole generators don't look at the source focus). And in species.txt (from rev 4547) I would replace:

Code: Select all

            location = Or [
                TargetPopulation low = 1
                Contains Building "BLD_GAS_GIANT_GEN"
            ]
by:

Code: Select all

            location = TargetPopulation low = 1
(This is a derivative work, and like the original subject to the GNU GPL 2.0.)

ps: I've also seen random starvation with humans on rev 4521

Zireael
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#11 Post by Zireael »

I see random famines on some of my planets when my entire empire is connected to the capital and I have farming surplus every turn. What does that mean?
I've had it too. Really surprised me.

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Geoff the Medio
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#12 Post by Geoff the Medio »

Zireael wrote:
I see random famines on some of my planets when my entire empire is connected to the capital and I have farming surplus every turn. What does that mean?
I've had it too. Really surprised me.
Save files that reproduce the result would be helpful...

It might be due to enemy or monster fleet movements. Is there any visible change in the displayed coloured starlanes between systems?

unjashfan
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#13 Post by unjashfan »

Save files that reproduce the result would be helpful...

It might be due to enemy or monster fleet movements. Is there any visible change in the displayed coloured starlanes between systems?
I know I've double checked the coloured supply lanes between the systems and every one of them are connected to the capital. I'll try to find a save file that reproduces the result; I lost track of my save files and ended up deleting all of them recently :(. I've also noticed that famine tends to strike planets that have just been terraformed or gaia transformed the turn before. I'm going to play around with that and try to figure out what exactly happens.
For the Gas Giant generator, are you sure you have focus set on industry?

About Singularity of Transcendence, yes, victory does nothing as of yet (there's some thread on the forum where Geoff says this, I can't find the quote right now).

The torpedoes were removed in the re-haul of weapons done (sorry, I can't find the thread again).

The Reconnaissance fighter probably won't exist until 3d combat is actually made, since fighters will probably be useless before...
Thanks! That was good to know.
I would suggest removing the need for focus industry from the gas giant. As this would make the game more intuitive (solar/black hole generators don't look at the source focus)
Agreed.
So yes, you need to set the planet's focus to industry to get any bonus from the gas giant generator, because the effect only acts on planets with focus industry that are in the same system as the planet with the generator on it, and because the effect is only active if the planet with the generator on it has focus industry. So, both the planet with the generator and the planet to receive the bonus need to have focus industry
I don't remember if I set the gas giant focus to industry. I also figured it was a static effect like the black hole generator because gas giants don't have an industry focus to begin with; I didn't consider it might gain the industry focus.

Zireael
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#14 Post by Zireael »

Geoff the Medio wrote:
Zireael wrote:
I see random famines on some of my planets when my entire empire is connected to the capital and I have farming surplus every turn. What does that mean?
I've had it too. Really surprised me.
Save files that reproduce the result would be helpful...

It might be due to enemy or monster fleet movements. Is there any visible change in the displayed coloured starlanes between systems?
In my game, there were no monster or enemies left :P And no, no changes in visible effects.
Can't find my saves now, sorry, really busy with studies :D

unjashfan
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Re: Random famine, unavailable techs/buildings

#15 Post by unjashfan »

Here are two save files with the random famine. One of them has food deficit, but there is remaining food stockpiled in the capital; the other one has food surplus.
Attachments
Famines.zip
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