Understanding Planet defenses

Problems and solutions for installing or running FreeOrion, including discussion of bugs if needed before posting a bug report. For problems building from source, post in Compile.

Moderators: Oberlus, Oberlus

Post Reply
Message
Author
ghealy
Space Kraken
Posts: 127
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:06 pm

Understanding Planet defenses

#1 Post by ghealy » Wed Aug 19, 2015 3:00 pm

Running FreeOrion_2015-08-10.2c00daa

Just got my butt whupped good when I went to attack this system.

How would one determine the necessary fire power to mount a successful attack on this system?

TIA

- Gene
Planet_defenses.jpg
Planet_defenses.jpg (63.06 KiB) Viewed 1512 times

pheldens
Pupating Mass
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:54 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#2 Post by pheldens » Wed Aug 19, 2015 7:36 pm

add up all the shields, you need that in fleet attack points to take their shields down, after its down send in the trooper ships, with 60 troops (10 normal troop ships) to take over the first planet

User avatar
MatGB
Creative Contributor
Posts: 3310
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:45 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#3 Post by MatGB » Wed Aug 19, 2015 8:30 pm

When attacking a planet, you first reduce Shields, then Defences, then Infrastructure.

For a planet to be listed 'incapacitated' at the end of a round and knocked out it has to have infrastructure, shields and defences at 0. Note that Outposts already have Inf 0.

For that system, to minimise losses I'd want about 350 combined damage minimal, that way the planets should nearly all be knocked out in the first round and thus only fire back once. If you don't mind losing some ships then you can get away with less but it could end up as a pyrrhic victory.

Alternative approach, a strattegy I'm only now testing out, is to stealth your attack fleet(s). If you go for Endosymbiotic hulls and give them at least the tier one stealth part then they're invisible to the AI in the early to mid game. Stealthed ships get a free shot in the first round and don't get hit at all until round two, so reducing planetary defences is a lot easier. But those hulls are more fragile so it's a tradeoff that needs careful balancing.

Making sure all ships have Structure of at least 40 is a good plan, then it takes at least two shot to kill them so while they'll need repairing they won't be lost to you.
Mat Bowles

Any code or patches in anything posted here is released under the CC and GPL licences in use for the FO project.

ghealy
Space Kraken
Posts: 127
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:06 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#4 Post by ghealy » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:56 pm

Phedens: So if I understand you correctly if I attack with a minimum of 60 troop ships after having defeated the the shields, etc, I would have enough troops to take over all the planets?

MatGB: This system has 231 shields (if my math is correct). Plus defenses of 140. Not quite understanding your '350'. Should my firepower be greater than the shields plus defense values or in this case 371?

FWIW, my ultimate ship is a robotic hull with plasma shields and death ray 1 weapons.

Do appreciate the help and the patience with this novice. Again, thanks.

- Gene

User avatar
MatGB
Creative Contributor
Posts: 3310
Joined: Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:45 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#5 Post by MatGB » Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:31 am

ghealy wrote:Phedens: So if I understand you correctly if I attack with a minimum of 60 troop ships after having defeated the the shields, etc, I would have enough troops to take over all the planets?
Don't send the troop ships in in the first wave, replacing them's going to cost money, take the system witha warfleet, then move in troops to invade next turn with a garrison fleet staying to hold it while the warfleet moves on.
MatGB: This system has 231 shields (if my math is correct). Plus defenses of 140. Not quite understanding your '350'. Should my firepower be greater than the shields plus defense values or in this case 371?
Note: "about" 350, I did the maths in my head, if you've got at least 350 firepower then you'll knock down enough defences in the first of the three rounds of combat that the second round shots won't do much damage and there won't be a third round. More is better, if you've at least 420 firepower then you're almost certain to take out all their defences in round one without losing a ship (you might get unlucky and have a majority of ships fire at the same target, this is part of the game).
FWIW, my ultimate ship is a robotic hull with plasma shields and death ray 1 weapons.
3 guns, armour plating (at least Diamond by now I'd hope?), shields, if you've at least 350 firepower you should take the system with no lost ships, at least 400 should see you with minimal damage to all but one or two ships. Again, odds, if all the planets fire at one of your ships it's dead, not much can stop that.
Do appreciate the help and the patience with this novice. Again, thanks.

- Gene
It's no problem, it's not an easy thing to work out for even experienced players sometimes, and since the AI started using the Defence focus more it's become riskier to simply charge headon into enemy territory (which is a good thing for game balance but not as good for fleet survival).

Strongly recommend researching Nanorobotic Hulls and Self Gravitating hulls (the former are cheaper and easier to use, the latter quicker to research, more blunt force powerful but not as flexible). Or switch to, for example, the Energy line of hulls and have fun with Fractal and Quantum hulls, they're fast.
Mat Bowles

Any code or patches in anything posted here is released under the CC and GPL licences in use for the FO project.

ghealy
Space Kraken
Posts: 127
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:06 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#6 Post by ghealy » Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:04 am

Thanks Matt. Will check that out

- Gene

pheldens
Pupating Mass
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:54 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#7 Post by pheldens » Thu Aug 20, 2015 9:11 am

ghealy wrote:Phedens: So if I understand you correctly if I attack with a minimum of 60 troop ships after having defeated the the shields, etc, I would have enough troops to take over all the planets?
no, to invade all their colonies after their defenses are down, you need 31 troop ships (for each colony top to bottom: 10 5 10 3 3) each regular troop ship has 6 troops, presuming their garissons haven't grown while you are producing those ships.

ghealy
Space Kraken
Posts: 127
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:06 pm

Re: Understanding Planet defenses

#8 Post by ghealy » Fri Aug 21, 2015 12:52 am

Phedens: Sorry. Obviously math was never one of my strong suits. :D 31 it is.

- Gene

Post Reply