Shipyards
Moderator: Oberlus
@EA
In my proposal, I try to make rules with no exceptions so the player will agree with the AI 100%. So, for instance, while it is more realistic to upgrading your shipyard at a cost, I propose no cost so there is no situation that I can imagine where you don't want to upgrade.
"Skdiw" is one of my screen name for playing networked games. I never heard of ski-doo before. Although the pronounciation is the same, my original goal in coining "skdiw" is a name that sounds simple and retarded hoping to aggregate my network opponent so I made up some retarded sounding name like ski-doo.
@Discord
Hmmm... I haven't thought of it that way. You need to list the details more and describe your ideas better. So I guess you would lump ship designing, defenses onto the same screen? But planetary defenses and shipyard really should be built individually.
In my proposal, I try to make rules with no exceptions so the player will agree with the AI 100%. So, for instance, while it is more realistic to upgrading your shipyard at a cost, I propose no cost so there is no situation that I can imagine where you don't want to upgrade.
"Skdiw" is one of my screen name for playing networked games. I never heard of ski-doo before. Although the pronounciation is the same, my original goal in coining "skdiw" is a name that sounds simple and retarded hoping to aggregate my network opponent so I made up some retarded sounding name like ski-doo.
@Discord
Hmmm... I haven't thought of it that way. You need to list the details more and describe your ideas better. So I guess you would lump ship designing, defenses onto the same screen? But planetary defenses and shipyard really should be built individually.
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- Space Kraken
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 7:28 pm
That's a good goal, but I don't think "your biggest producing planet to take your heaviest order" is a policy with which the player will always agree. Maybe your biggest-producing planet is too far from the front, or perhaps it is about to be captured.skdiw wrote:In my proposal, I try to make rules with no exceptions so the player will agree with the AI 100%.
If maintenance costs go up when you upgrade, then the player may not wish to upgrade (even if it's free). If maintenance costs do not go up, then it seems to me that shipyards are essentially free, so we could just assume they are built everywhere and not worry about it. If this is not the case, please let me know where the cost for shipyards comes in.So, for instance, while it is more realistic to upgrading your shipyard at a cost, I propose no cost so there is no situation that I can imagine where you don't want to upgrade.
You must live somewhere warm...."Skdiw" is one of my screen name for playing networked games. I never heard of ski-doo before.
discord: Ok, I see where you are coming from. It would be nice since you could design things like mobile shipyards. But I think it would infect shipyards with the complexity of ship design, and make upgrading too much of a chore. People like to design new battleships, but I doubt they would enjoy designing something more mundane like a shipyard. To avoid that complexity, I be willing to go for shipyards that can't be armed and armoured in themselves.
But yeah, work out the design a bit more. It seems interesting.
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- Creative Contributor
- Posts: 314
- Joined: Tue Aug 26, 2003 6:10 pm
- Location: Amidst the Inferno.
Actually, EA, I don't think it would need to be that complex. Certain defenses (like, perhaps, laser arrays) would always be orbital and would always be added to the space station. Most shipyard upgrades would also be added to the local space station. I don't think there is any reason to make the player decide where and how to build them (just if.)
Time flies like the wind, fruit flies like bananas.
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- Space Kraken
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 7:28 pm
Ablaze: I guess it could work if orbital defences/shipyards/etc were just modules in one big space station. Otherwise we have the possibility of multiple shipyards in orbit, and that's not something I want to deal with.
I also prefer to allow the option of having many small orbital platforms instead of a monolithic one for each planet.... and I like shipyards that are nice and vulnerable. Make people sweat a little.
I also prefer to allow the option of having many small orbital platforms instead of a monolithic one for each planet.... and I like shipyards that are nice and vulnerable. Make people sweat a little.
There's no way that you can guarantee that the player will agree with the AI 100% of the time.skdiw wrote: In my proposal, I try to make rules with no exceptions so the player will agree with the AI 100%.
If everyone could upgrade at no cost, then, well that just does not work. It's crazy. How can it cost nothing to upgrade. I supose if your shipyard automatically upgraded itself, there would still be a cost, it would be taken from the planetary cash, or what ever money is allocated to the shipyard industry on that planet.skdiw wrote: So, for instance, while it is more realistic to upgrading your shipyard at a cost, I propose no cost so there is no situation that I can imagine where you don't want to upgrade.
EA: the economicly most sound idea would be to have them seperated, BUT if you want'em to, you can have them as one.
point being, i dont like being forced into any kind of action, mobile shipyards would be a must for nomadic species, and pretty useful for pirates.
and, there are no problems with having multiple yards around the same planet. more docks, more people doing the work, but as i have said before, for my idea of a shipyard to work, production must be mobile.
ablaze: actualy EA was against combining them, it is me you should toss that to, and i do see a reason, firstly that i dont see a reason to not have the choice, most would prolly go with the standard way....but not all.
//discord
point being, i dont like being forced into any kind of action, mobile shipyards would be a must for nomadic species, and pretty useful for pirates.
and, there are no problems with having multiple yards around the same planet. more docks, more people doing the work, but as i have said before, for my idea of a shipyard to work, production must be mobile.
ablaze: actualy EA was against combining them, it is me you should toss that to, and i do see a reason, firstly that i dont see a reason to not have the choice, most would prolly go with the standard way....but not all.
//discord
I didn't intend this part to be 100% micro free.EntropyAvatar wrote:That's a good goal, but I don't think "your biggest producing planet to take your heaviest order" is a policy with which the player will always agree. Maybe your biggest-producing planet is too far from the front, or perhaps it is about to be captured.skdiw wrote:In my proposal, I try to make rules with no exceptions so the player will agree with the AI 100%.
This part I did intend to simplify things so there is no micro. You just pay an initial shipyard fee and future upgrades and maintenence are completely free. Instead of maintenence, we can do nets so the maintenence is automatically factored into the pp coversion rate. @untilae: you pay for the "free" upgrade when you do research for that upgrade. I was focusing on gameplay micro issue rather than realism.If maintenance costs go up when you upgrade, then the player may not wish to upgrade (even if it's free). If maintenance costs do not go up, then it seems to me that shipyards are essentially free, so we could just assume they are built everywhere and not worry about it. If this is not the case, please let me know where the cost for shipyards comes in.So, for instance, while it is more realistic to upgrading your shipyard at a cost, I propose no cost so there is no situation that I can imagine where you don't want to upgrade.
Funny that you mention it. I just tempoary moved toward the equator just a couple weeks ago, but formerly, I was in the US where the temperature is rather cool ~22 C.You must live somewhere warm...."Skdiw" is one of my screen name for playing networked games. I never heard of ski-doo before.
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- Space Kraken
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 7:28 pm
The thing is, the intial shipyard fee will have to be very small by mid or late-game standards in order to be affordable at all in the early game. If maintenance is just some fraction of the money you are currently spending on ships, this is equivalent to just changing the price of ships. As far as I can see, such a system is well-approximated by taking shipyards out of the game. Which is of course an option.skdiw wrote:This part I did intend to simplify things so there is no micro. You just pay an initial shipyard fee and future upgrades and maintenence are completely free. Instead of maintenence, we can do nets so the maintenence is automatically factored into the pp coversion rate.
22 C? That's like swimsuit weatherFunny that you mention it. I just tempoary moved toward the equator just a couple weeks ago, but formerly, I was in the US where the temperature is rather cool ~22 C.
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- Space Kraken
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 7:28 pm
Why don't we just have the upgrades be automatic. Based on how much cash is put into shipyards. So the more cash you put in, the more a shipyard is upgraded and the faster they are upgraded. Not much cash going to shipyards, then they upgrade slowly or not at all, until they have enough cash invested.