Exobot Ideas

For what's not in 'Top Priority Game Design'. Post your ideas, visions, suggestions for the game, rules, modifications, etc.

Moderators: Oberlus, Oberlus

Message
Author
User avatar
Oberlus
Cosmic Dragon
Posts: 1406
Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:25 pm

Re: Exobot Ideas

#31 Post by Oberlus » Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:25 pm

Pfff... My own nerdiness is hindering my reasoning here.

Harmoniliths, since they are lithic, it makes sense (to me) they can live deep in GGs, assuming lithic metabolisms can cope well with huge preasures and high temperatures.
Envirobrains, pictured as jellyfish or octopus (i.e. aquatic), wouldn't like to have to "swim" in an environment thicker than bitumen/tar or even in supercritical fluids. I picture Sly (gasbags) as living in the upper atmosphere of GGs, floating, but I can't picture octopuses "floating" in an hidrogen atmosphere. Because Envirobrains are aquatic, I'd like them in Terran, Swamp and Ocean, the most aquatic environments.

What about moving Exobot to Desert-Tundra-Barren, Harmoniliths Radiated-Inferno-Toxic and Envirobrains Terran-Ocean-Swamp?

The fact that Exobots are not Lithic is aside from the fact that the Crystal special is great for Empires rich in lithic populations. So, you place one single asteroid (with exobots) to growth focus and you get the bonus to all the rest lithic planets, including Harmoniliths on non-asteroid planets. You have no interest at all in the population bonus that would give the Crystal special to Harmoniliths in the Crystal asteroid belt itself, because they would be focused on growth and hence they would be producing nothing. And the rest of Harmoniliths in asteroid belts would be focused on influence, and hence would not get the production bonus from the eventual extra crystals they could have. You get more PPs and the same IPs if you let the Exobots in asteroids.

And yes, I confused Fulver with Jaumito's Nerada.

User avatar
labgnome
Vacuum Dragon
Posts: 566
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:57 pm

Re: Exobot Ideas

#32 Post by labgnome » Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:19 pm

Oberlus wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:25 pm
Pfff... My own nerdiness is hindering my reasoning here.
Like I wouldn't understand that.
Harmoniliths, since they are lithic, it makes sense (to me) they can live deep in GGs, assuming lithic metabolisms can cope well with huge preasures and high temperatures.
See I was thinking of them not having much in the way of minerals to consume on gas giants and thus not really being able to grow there. Asteroids on the other hand...
Envirobrains, pictured as jellyfish or octopus (i.e. aquatic), wouldn't like to have to "swim" in an environment thicker than bitumen/tar or even in supercritical fluids. I picture Sly (gasbags) as living in the upper atmosphere of GGs, floating, but I can't picture octopuses "floating" in an hidrogen atmosphere. Because Envirobrains are aquatic, I'd like them in Terran, Swamp and Ocean, the most aquatic environments.
See I was picturing them preferring something nice and thick to just sit and float and think in, and thinking of the stereotypical "jellyfish floater" gas-giant creature. So weather the waters of ocean planets, or the mud of swamp plants or the sludge of toxic planets they would be at home.
What about moving Exobot to Desert-Tundra-Barren, Harmoniliths Radiated-Inferno-Toxic and Envirobrains Terran-Ocean-Swamp?

The fact that Exobots are not Lithic is aside from the fact that the Crystal special is great for Empires rich in lithic populations. So, you place one single asteroid (with exobots) to growth focus and you get the bonus to all the rest lithic planets, including Harmoniliths on non-asteroid planets. You have no interest at all in the population bonus that would give the Crystal special to Harmoniliths in the Crystal asteroid belt itself, because they would be focused on growth and hence they would be producing nothing. And the rest of Harmoniliths in asteroid belts would be focused on influence, and hence would not get the production bonus from the eventual extra crystals they could have. You get more PPs and the same IPs if you let the Exobots in asteroids.
So Exobots are supposed to get the robotic growth specials, which are only on the barren, radiated and inferno planets. If we move Exobots to desert, tundra and barren this messes-up that whole setup and we might want or even need to re-evaluate the distributions of the growth specials. Which is something which is an even bigger consideration than just introducing new species.

Going off of that, any lithic artificial species should be able to take advantage of the lithic metabolism special on asteroids. To my knowledge you have to be of the right metabolism to even use a special for the growth focus, so you can't use the crystals special in asteroid belts with exobots, as they are robotic not lithic.

If we are going to be switching around habitability, Harmonoliths can get asteroids and Exobots can loose them, if we want to have only one artificial species get them.

However if we are going to re-think the metabolism specials that is going to be quite an undertaking, but we could instead move one of the robotic specials to asteroids, if you are determined that only Exobots should get asteroids. It's a question of which task you would rather undertake.

However, if I remember correctly that one of the reasons that the "Gaseous" metabolism was created was that having the growth focus and having gas giants was considered too powerful at the time. So maybe having any of the artificial species get gas giants is a bad idea.

I'm going to go-ahead and re-suggest my former arrangement minus gas giant preference, as it's the simplest and works the best with what is already in the game, and requires the least re-working, and will be fairly strait-forward and easy to follow. Everyone gets asteroids, but at a different tolerance and no-one gets gas giants.

Exobots
  • Adequate: Barren, Radiated, Inferno
  • Poor: Tundra, Toxic, Asteroid
  • Hostile: Swamp, Ocean, Terran, Desert
Envirobrains
  • Adequate: Toxic, Swamp, Ocean
  • Poor: Inferno, Terran
  • Hostile: Desert, Tundra, Barren, Inferno, Asteroid
Harmonoliths
  • Adequate: Terran, Desert, Tundra, Asteroid
  • Poor: Ocean, Barren
  • Hostile: Radiated, Inferno, Toxic, Swamp
All of my contributions should be considered released under creative commons attribution share-alike license, CC-BY-SA 3.0 for use in, by and with the Free Orion project.

User avatar
Oberlus
Cosmic Dragon
Posts: 1406
Joined: Mon Apr 10, 2017 4:25 pm

Re: Exobot Ideas

#33 Post by Oberlus » Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:35 pm

labgnome wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:19 pm
See I was thinking of them not having much in the way of minerals to consume on gas giants and thus not really being able to grow there.
The same applies to every living being. We all need minerals to live. Plus GGs are not free of minerals in their cores.
So Exobots are supposed to get the robotic growth specials, which are only on the barren, radiated and inferno planets. If we move Exobots to desert, tundra and barren this messes-up that whole setup and we might want or even need to re-evaluate the distributions of the growth specials.
I don't find problematic moving specials between environments. Plus there is no real problem here because:
To my knowledge you have to be of the right metabolism to even use a special for the growth focus
That is false (now). Exobots can be set to growth in an asteroid with Crystals and you get the bonus on every lithic-populated world supply-connected.

Exobots in barren and asteroids (that is tiny barren worlds) makes a lot of sense (immersion for me).
However, if I remember correctly that one of the reasons that the "Gaseous" metabolism was created was that having the growth focus and having gas giants was considered too powerful at the time. So maybe having any of the artificial species get gas giants is a bad idea.
That could be solved by setting a malus on GGs or not allowing the special bonuses on GGs.

User avatar
Krikkitone
Creative Contributor
Posts: 1496
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2003 6:52 pm

Re: Exobot Ideas

#34 Post by Krikkitone » Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:11 pm

Oberlus wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:35 pm
However, if I remember correctly that one of the reasons that the "Gaseous" metabolism was created was that having the growth focus and having gas giants was considered too powerful at the time. So maybe having any of the artificial species get gas giants is a bad idea.
That could be solved by setting a malus on GGs or not allowing the special bonuses on GGs.
Or have a 4th "exobot" using the gaseous metabolism (say high level so it can have any focus.. but not particularly good at any)

User avatar
labgnome
Vacuum Dragon
Posts: 566
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:57 pm

Re: Exobot Ideas

#35 Post by labgnome » Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:32 pm

Krikkitone wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:11 pm
Oberlus wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:35 pm
However, if I remember correctly that one of the reasons that the "Gaseous" metabolism was created was that having the growth focus and having gas giants was considered too powerful at the time. So maybe having any of the artificial species get gas giants is a bad idea.
That could be solved by setting a malus on GGs or not allowing the special bonuses on GGs.
Or have a 4th "exobot" using the gaseous metabolism (say high level so it can have any focus.. but not particularly good at any)
I could see that, a species of "Jovians", that are gas-giant generalists, maybe something for the Void theme.
All of my contributions should be considered released under creative commons attribution share-alike license, CC-BY-SA 3.0 for use in, by and with the Free Orion project.

Post Reply